Feb 272015
 

Please forward this to anyone you know who is an RCMP or police officer, or who works in security forces. Thanks!

– – – – – – –

It is not difficult to put forward a likely reason why some young Canadians are going to Syria to join the “terrorists”.

In 2010 I was contacted through social media by a young sister of Omar Khadr’s who had read a posting of mine. She was desperate, using facebook to raise awareness, getting help to bring her brother home.

My posting contained reports from the pre-trial hearing in 2010 of the depraved and highly illegal torture of 15-year-old Omar Khadr at offshore American prisons. (If my son had been treated the same I would hate the perpetrators.)

So figure it out. Lots of young Canadians KNOW what happened to Omar Khadr at the hands of we ourselves – – “Westerners”.  It was truly gross, unimaginable that humans can do these things to any living creature, let alone a 15-year-old boy.

I don’t know the number of young people who are “in the know”;  a large number  joined the support groups for Omar Khadr.   People became well-informed through the sharing of information.   There is lots in the public domain about the failure of the Canadian Government to get Khadr out of Guatanamo, a known place of torture – – all of the Western nations except Canada,  arranged for their citizens to be removed.   We joined the evil-doers.

Injustice is not forgotten.

I can see young people, altruistic and idealistic, going off to help fight “the demons” (depraved Westerners).

. . . Something else, let’s see how much media coverage this gets: it is now known that the leader of ISIS was imprisoned by the Americans in 2004 and later released.  See 2015-02-19 One year in US custody as ‘civilian detainee’: Declassified files shed light on mysterious ISIS leader

Who knows what he was subjected to? He was not in Bagram or Abu Ghraib.   Even IF (best case scenario) he did not receive the torture inflicted on others, he would have known about the torture being done to his countrymen.

If you, a young man, had done to your manhood what was done to prisoners, my understanding of human behaviour leads me to believe that you would be so full of hatred, you would be out for revenge, big time.   What goes around comes around.

As Pogo said, “I have seen the enemy and he is us.” Sad but true.

Kids going off to Syria are as likely to be idealists as they are to be “terrorists”.

  18 Responses to “2015-02-27 Not difficult to figure out why young people join ISIS.”

  1. From: Emeline
    Sent: February-27-15 10:45 AM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    I totally disagree. When there are so many opportunities to make a good life in Canada, to do something positive with yourself, to focus on one mistake and to justify it as an excuse to become a terrorist is inexcusable. What a rant you are on!

    • From: Sandra Finley
      Sent: February-27-15 11:29 AM
      To: ‘Emeline’
      Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

      I know you disagree. You can say that. I accept it.
      But saying that I am on a “rant” is an attempt to discredit what I am saying, without offering any reason.
      Here is what I am doing: trying to put myself just a little into the other guys’ shoes, to understand where they are coming from.
      I know that if any member of my family had been brutalized the way that Omar Khadr was brutalized (and remember that the inquiry into his situation supported Khadr, not the Government) I could not help but be thoroughly disillusioned. Do you think that your head would not be affected if David (son) was severely abused in the most heinous fashion?

      • From: Emeline
        Sent: February-27-15 11:37 AM
        To: Sandra Finley
        Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

        I am certain if the govt. could go back in time, the treatment of Omar would be different. What govt./country is the perfect world? A mistake was made. What is your answer? You understand being dissolutioned. Yes, but that is cause to become a terriorist? I am sure ISSIS doesn’t make mistakes….like beheadings, burning in a cage. Where do you want to live…what country would be the answer for you? Finding fault is easy….correcting problems in a positive way is the challenge.

  2. From: Sandra Finley
    Sent: February-27-15 12:42 PM
    To: ‘Emeline’
    Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    What needs to happen, and what is being called for: find out what the problem is. WHY are these kids doing what they are doing?
    I am not willing to assign the label “terrorist” to them, not at this point when they have not performed acts of terrorism.

    RE: Finding fault is easy….correcting problems in a positive way is the challenge.

    I said that these kids are as likely to be idealists as they are to be terrorists. If we can remove the stereotype of “terrorist” we are more likely to be able to find solutions.

    RE: your question, “what country would be the answer for you?”

    You like Canada as it is (or was). I think people are dreaming in technicolour if they think there will be no consequences from participation in the violence inflicted on others (the Iraq War was another big “mistake” by Westerners. Afghanistan.) Our role has to be different, one of finding solutions without killing.

    Angela Merkl did the right thing in dissuading the Americans from arming the Ukraine. Where is Canadian leadership?

    You might be interested, “The role of ego in putting democracy to rest”. http://sandrafinley.ca/?p=10753

    • From: Emeline
      Sent: February-27-15 5:06 PM
      To: Sandra Finley
      Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

      David had a friend ( good family, parents were there at soccer games,etc) who got involved with the wrong crowd( drugs). He was shot dead. What a shock! I asked David why he got into that crowd? Possibilities: initially exciting, becoming someone of importance, being rebellious, then getting in too deep and not being able to get out. An age when it is easy to be influenced/vulnerable.

      I agree with Angela Merkel and negotiating, however, the Russians did not honor the cease fire as agreed upon.

      • From: Sandra Finley
        Sent: February-28-15 11:29 AM
        To: ‘Emeline’
        Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

        Thanks to David for his insight. Well said.

        That is what needs to be explored – – how do we equip young people to deal with “initially exciting” and HOW TO EXIT. Seems to me it reflects what you have described as your experience with relationship. Did not know how to get in and then out of relationships that were unhealthy.

        It gives me confidence knowing that persons like David are in the school system, working with kids.

  3. From: Peter
    Sent: February-27-15 11:03 AM
    To: ‘Sandra Finley’
    Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria (private)

    Sandra, with respect, two wrongs do NOT make a right. Militant Islam only has two categories; adherents and victims. Would you advocate militant feminists, or gays to adopt murder and barbarism as an operational tactic?

    Best,

    Peter

    • From: Sandra Finley
      Sent: February-27-15 11:59 AM
      To: ‘Peter’
      Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria (private)

      Hi Peter,

      (Referred to above from Emeline) … and continued:

      Another friend wrote on facebook (abbreviated):
      • What constitutes a valid reason to kill innocents?

      My reply: Mary, the same question applies to “Westerners”.

      Look at just one example, from which people in the Middle East judge us. (Unfortunately Canadians are now thoroughly in the U.S. orbit, we are guilty by association with the Americans.) = = the dropping of bombs on Iraq in 2003. The Iraqis had no “weapons of mass destruction”. It was an illegal war, without UN sanction. Not only were thousands of innocents killed, but their infrastructure, hospitals, schools, homes were destroyed. More than a million became refugees, overflowing into neighbouring countries that don’t have the resources to provide for them. Then the dropping of bombs from drones – – large numbers of innocents killed.

      I believe that violence begets violence. Western nations are part of the problem. Until we acknowledge it, the status quo of killing (with major profits to the war corporations) will not end.

      Bless Angela Merkl, the German Chancellor. When the Americans were going to provide arms to Ukrainians, she went to see Obama with the message that that is a failed strategy.

      There are people who are dedicated to finding solutions. The killing way doesn’t work and never has.
      ——–
      I hope that help clarifies where I am coming from, Peter.
      It’s a tough situation – – the past can’t be erased.
      Sandra

  4. From: Ron
    Sent: February-27-15 11:56 AM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    You only have to read reports of the Spanish Inquisition, Bolshevik interrogation methods and those of the Nazis, and of course our own police forces in years past, (Thankfully not so much now) to realize that torture is just as likely to provide mis-information than any useful intelligence. Force is never justified or necessary.

    • From: Ron
      Sent: February-27-15 1:42 PM
      To: Sandra Finley
      Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

      Sure. Go ahead. Publish my remarks. By-the-way, it was the trained FBI investigators who were shocked and opposed to “enhanced” interrogation methods. Until the waterboarding started they were getting good information from the prisoners. Once the torture began ( after the FBI were replaced), the terrorists stopped cooperating. The whole operation was a mess. Half the prisoners had no idea why they were arrested.

  5. From: Elaine
    Sent: February-27-15 12:13 PM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    Very good – we shouldn’t be surprised by any of what’s happening . . . inevitable, really.

    But, it is easier to become and remain ‘blind’ with fear and inadequacy than address most of our modern-day problems – it’s a matter of survival for as long as it lasts, eh?

    Be well

  6. From: Lisel
    Sent: February-27-15 3:30 PM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    Bang on!

  7. From: Cathleen
    Sent: February-27-15 6:11 PM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    Indeed, the line between idealism and what we call terrorism is a fine one. How, though, to stick with what Ursula le Guin in one of her books calls “the one true thing” – and not become the tormentor who tormented you and yours. Jews say, “never again” about the Holocaust but Israel is busy perpetrating important parts of it over again, and as a Jew I am horrified.

    Cathleen

    • From: Cathleen
      Sent: February-28-15 4:46 PM
      To: Sandra Finley
      Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

      I don’t mind (if you post to blog). The Cons are very successful in fomenting fear (not to say, terror 😉 ).

  8. From: Leo
    Sent: February-27-15 7:49 PM
    To: Sandra
    Subject: Fwd: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    Thank you for this Sandra. I feel better knowing that I’m not the only one to see it that way. It’s a sad world that we live in.–Leo

  9. From: Brent
    Sent: February-28-15 6:19 AM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: RE: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    Sandra –Yes the RCMP should be made aware that you are asssisting and promoting the likes of the Kadhr family —an insidious, evil den of snakes ,whom I fail to understand why ,are allowed to remain in this country . Your attitude toward this whole terrorist issue ,is a total disrespect to the men and women who serve in our country,s armed forces and the democracy that they defend .This democracy that allows you to blog ,as you do . Blog this . Brent

  10. From: Bev
    Sent: March-01-15 4:10 PM
    To: Sandra Finley
    Subject: Re: Not hard to figure out why some young Canadians go to Syria

    :Hi Sandra, have you sent this to any news papers? I sent a similar one to a lot of papers. One local one, Medicine Hat and Lethbridge published it but I don’t know if others did unless some one lets me know. I used the Pogo line as well.

    I tell people, no one has to lie to recruit ISIS followers, they just have to tell them the truth about what we have done in foreign counties. So true but you won’t hear any politicians say it. Good work

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